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Post by Admin Crusty on Apr 26, 2023 14:26:49 GMT
For 02, do we have more information on where these pilgrims were massacred? Was it somewhere in the peninsula itself? I heard it was on neutral lands but I'm unclear on whether that's inside the peninsula or outside it entirely. For 03, do we have any recent information on the Tartars? Little is known for certain of the attack on the pilgrims, it occurred in neutral territory beyond Christendom. We know that it was an isolated incident and most travel to and from the Holy Land seems to be unmolested, they still fall under the protections guaranteed by the infidel rulers there. All that can be said for certain is that the attack did occur, and there is speculation a party from Christendom searching for technology may have been among them, though again these are rumors of the millers and peasants and my sources have confirmed nothing. As for the Tartars, they are now operating deep inside Christendom and spread across the South, perhaps further. They do not seem to be causing any great conflagration as yet but their presence is foreboding. In some places they do appear to be settling, as King Percy notes in his report, which I would refer you all to for more detailed information, as he stands at the gates of Christendom and would know better than I. My sources are otherwise limited on this matter.
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Post by Consul Allectus de Gallia on Apr 26, 2023 16:51:05 GMT
Allectus would confer with his advisor for a moment before standing up to speak.
Thank you Captain and King Percy for the update to the Tartar situation on the peninsula.
I have no particular issue with integrating various peoples into our lands and combining the strengths of their culture and men at arms with our own.
However, these new settlers must welcome Christ as their lord and savior before being permitted a permanent settlement within our realms or on the peninsula.
It is one thing to border these heathens and be on the alert for a potential attack. It is quite another to have them among us and at arms length where they can turn on us at any moment.
I suggest a delegation be formed to speak with the other tribes in the neutral areas and perhaps encourage them to be baptized by our priests.
In this way, we may trade, deal and trust them as our fellow brothers and sisters in Christ.
If they refuse and choose to continue to practice their Satanic pagan ways, they should be met with the sword and God can judge them on the final day.
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Post by Lord-Archon Trajan Evander on Apr 26, 2023 19:15:01 GMT
Consul Allectus, to proceed with such a program to uplift and civilize the Tartars, what would you have this Imperial Diet do?
What body would search out these roving horse lords and spread the Good Word to them?
Same could be said of an investigation into the slaughtered pilgrims abroad. Who would send forth such a mission and report on it?
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Post by Duke Gary da Carlsen on Apr 26, 2023 19:45:54 GMT
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Post by Consul Allectus de Gallia on Apr 26, 2023 20:16:46 GMT
Consul Allectus, to proceed with such a program to uplift and civilize the Tartars, what would you have this Imperial Diet do? What body would search out these roving horse lords and spread the Good Word to them? Same could be said of an investigation into the slaughtered pilgrims abroad. Who would send forth such a mission and report on it? Lord Speaker and Lord Archon Trajan, If diplomacy and prudence is the order of the day and is desired by the Diet, I would motion for the creation of a delegation to be headed by one of our number and a second to serve as their lieutenant in meeting with and negotiating with these “Tartars”. Part of this delegation should include priests and a papal legate to carry the word of God to these peoples. A similar delegation should also be dispatched to the Caliph and/or Emir controlling the holy lands to discuss ways in which we can work to better protect pilgrims on the road to the Holy Land. They have a vested economic interest to ensure pilgrims make it there safely and spend their time and coin there. Perhaps another Holy Order can be commissioned to set up way stations and hospitals to defend sick and injured pilgrims along the way.
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Post by Alfred Von Gewisse on Apr 26, 2023 20:39:35 GMT
The Diet has not enough had enough volunteers for one holy order. Where will the funds come for a second? Seems the local lords should either live with the risk or coordinate a joint action.
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Post by King Percy LXII of Percia on Apr 26, 2023 21:08:37 GMT
Percia will not contribute funds to a crusade in her own region. These Tartars settled in my land on the condition of their conversion to Christianity, and they have been faithful to their promise. Other Tartar tribes may wander the unsettled areas, and when Percia expands to contain these new lands, they will be made civilized.
This is not an international issue that Percia intends to create and fund some “program” to deal with.
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Post by Alfred Von Gewisse on Apr 26, 2023 21:42:18 GMT
Seems the matter is settled then. I doubt the funds could be found for a program anyway King Percy. How many Kings here voted for a Holy Order and then didn't find it, like a bunch of misers?
While I voted no for the Holy Order, knowing that it would be difficult to raise the funds for it, let it be known I will provide funding. A city without a keep is only asking for slaughter. I am not only a Shephard to my people, but also a Shephard to all Christians.
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Post by Duke Gary da Carlsen on Apr 26, 2023 22:05:11 GMT
At the very least, I inclined to agree that it would be imprudent to try to fund a second holy order before the first one has the castle funded. Chase both rabbits, catch neither, and all that.
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Post by Consul Allectus de Gallia on Apr 26, 2023 22:21:51 GMT
Percia will not contribute funds to a crusade in her own region. These Tartars settled in my land on the condition of their conversion to Christianity, and they have been faithful to their promise. Other Tartar tribes may wander the unsettled areas, and when Percia expands to contain these new lands, they will be made civilized. This is not an international issue that Percia intends to create and fund some “program” to deal with. Good King Percy, What you choose to do with the Tartars within your own domain is your prerogative. I’m discussing the need to Christianize and perhaps drive out those barbarians who roam unclaimed lands and who refuse to convert to the one true faith.
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Post by King Percy LXII of Percia on Apr 27, 2023 0:34:50 GMT
As these lands are soon to come under my control, I regard this issue as a domestic issue. I will deal with them as I am required to. All the rest of you, with the exception of perhaps Green Castle, are far from this issue and have no stake in the matter.
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Post by Lord-Archon Trajan Evander on Apr 27, 2023 3:12:17 GMT
If there is such a concern for these Tartars and the vast expanses of the now abandoned lands between our realms, and there is no taste for a funded or organized mission, we as the Imperial Diet can pass laws for those we rule over, with the consent of their lords.
A solution I offer is a law requiring all merchants, traders, and otherwise travelers who deal with these Tartars or discover their whereabouts must then report their findings to the nearest priest, when practical. From there, as the Holy Father, His Papal Worshipfulness, may command the priests to then contact and offer baptism to these unwashed peoples.
Or simply make trading or otherwise support these Horse Lords illegal unless they are Christian.
If we cannot find an agreeable ground here, we should progress to other matters.
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Post by Duke Gary da Carlsen on Apr 27, 2023 3:27:29 GMT
A solution I offer is a law requiring all merchants, traders, and otherwise travelers who deal with these Tartars or discover their whereabouts must then report their findings to the nearest priest, when practical. From there, as the Holy Father, His Papal Worshipfulness, may command the priests to then contact and offer baptism to these unwashed peoples. This seems reasonable to me.
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Post by Alfred Von Gewisse on Apr 27, 2023 14:08:46 GMT
Based on the words of King Percy, I find this unnecessary
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Post by Consul Allectus de Gallia on Apr 27, 2023 15:48:12 GMT
I concur with Duke da Carlsen and Lord Archon Evander.
If these barbarians will not convert and there’s no appetite among God Fearing Christians to put them to the sword, we should at the very least make it difficult to live off the land or trade with other Christian realms.
I would support an initial interaction to determine their whereabouts and temperament. If they are amenable to conversion, they are welcomed as fellow brothers in Christ. If not, we will allow the monks and priests to proselytize them. Failure to do so, dealing with said tribes will be prohibited until they renounced their pagan ways.
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